Long time lurker, first time poster!

[tommycarl]

I'm betting/hoping that after sitting for only a couple of years, the bike might start. You're certainly welcome to take off the carbs at any time if you want to clean them. I think there's a huge chance that you're going to be cleaning them at some point anyway, but if you're like me, there's just some comfort in the fact the an engine will run before I take things apart.

Carbs can be "bad" in different ways. Can make the bike hard to start, but run okay at high RPM. Can start fine, but not run at high RPM... and anything in between.

The fact that you get popping is a good sign to me. the fact that you get gas is a good sign. The fact that you get spark is a good sign. You need gas, spark, and compression to run... and it all has to come together at the right time. So if the plugs aren't sparking at the right time, it's not good.

Did you have all the plug wires off at the same time and could you have gotten them mixed up? If so, that's a place to begin. Did you get all the gas out of the carb bowls by draining them? If not, the moisture you're getting at the plugs could still be that bad gas and that would contribute to the problem.

I'm going to post this, then continue with other info... maybe you can read this and answer so we can save some time.

 

[tommycarl]

Darn it Ricardo... I need to look at the manual a bit to be sure I'm not giving you wrong information about the coils and spark plug routing. I'm thinking about wire colors for an older single overhead cam bike, and you have a dual overhead cam. I could be awhile.

 

[Ricardoc4]

While I was draining the float bowls a friend of mine was changing the spark plugs.
He says that he didn't mixed them up, but I have my doubts...

 

[tommycarl]

Okay. So look at the coils under the tank. The left hand coil should have a blue wire going to it. The coil with the blue wire should connect to spark plugs 1 and 4... those are the outside spark plugs. The other coil should have a yellow wire going to it... that coil should connect to spark plugs 2 and 3... those are the inside spark plugs. Just be sure the coil with the blue wire connects to 1 and 4, and the one with the yellow wire connects to 2 and 3.

as long as you have the correct coil, it won't make any difference which of the 2 correct plugs it connects to. Number 1-4 coil fires each time number 1 or 4 piston is at top dead center, and one of the plugs just ahs a "wasted" spark. Same for 2 and 3.

 

[Ricardoc4]

I checked the manual and your instructions and the plug wires are connected properly!
It amazes me how much you guys know..

 

[tommycarl]

Well that's good. However, it means that it isn't quite as easy as it could be. If it was me, I'd try to be patient. Let the bike sit overnight, then try again.

REMINDER... shut off the petcock! We don't the carbs overflowing and filling up the crankcase again.

In fact, you should be turning off that petcock every time you stop trying to start the bike. Just remember to turn it on to start it.

 

[Ricardoc4]

I think it's the best idea..

And thank you for the reminder! I've thought about it all day and how I really don't want to change the oil again on short notice!

I've also made a couple of pics of the teardown and the overall state of the bike.
I will be uploading them tomorrow.
Once I get it running, the real job begins to make it roadworthy again..

 

[tommycarl]

Well I suppose it's getting a little late over there, so letting the bike sit overnight might not be such a hard thing to do. I've done stranger things many times... like having someone push me on the bike to try and get it going... or tie a rope to it and have someone pull me behind the car. Heck, the last time I tried pulling one, it was behind an off-terrain go-cart I had. That was actually a pretty easy one to set up.

CAUTION! Don't try things in your own home! lol

I would suggest that you spray some starting fluid (ether) in the carbs, but that's pretty hard to do with the airbox on... and the bike really needs the airbox and filter with the stock carbs. If you can aim the ether into the air entrance to the airbox, that would maybe work, but the opening is probably pretty well hidden and hard to get to. Besides that, too much ether won't be good for the engine.

Just out of curiosity, did you find the inside of the airbox to be filled with insect homes or maybe a mouse nest, or was it pretty clean in there?

 

[tommycarl]

Also, you haven't mentioned any gas overflow through the hoses again... did that get "fixed" after draining and putting in new gas, or tapping with a screwdriver?

 

[Ricardoc4]

Hahahaha! I don't have a dead wish!
And the airbox was surprisingly clean! No dead mice or insects!

So it's a bad idea to remove the airbox and try the ether thing?
Because that was my plan of attack for tomorrow morning

 

[Ricardoc4]

Nope, no gas overflow!

 

[tommycarl]

On that bike, if I was going to try ether, I'd consider 3 ways:

1. Shoot it in the airbox opening where the air flows
2. Take off the side cover and shoot it in the side
3. Remove the 2 outside plugs and Squirt it in the spark plug holes.

I wouldn't take off the airbox because for one, that's a chore you won't enjoy; and two, it's no fun putting back on either! While we're on the topic, if you're planning on getting rid of the airbox and using pod filters with stock CV carbs, I suggest that you forget about it already. You MIGHT get the bike to run okay that way, but you'll be an expert at removing and installing carbs before you get the job done, and you'll be really familiar with jets too!

Now back to the bike.

You mentioned that one spark plug was dry. It will probably be a good idea to open the drain screw for that carburetor to be sure there's gas in the bowl. If the float valve stuck closed, you won't get any gas. However, I suppose there's a chance that the popping was coming from that cylinder, and the other three were wet and flooded. That actually kinda makes sense to me; if the bike was really only trying to start on the one "dry" cylinder, it would probably just pop now and then and not start, so maybe that's the only one that doesn't need attention. Maybe it'll fire up tomorrow night after sitting awhile.

 

[Ricardoc4]

Lucy is alive!

I checked and double checked everything before I messed with the ether.
Somehow, my fuel filter isn't letting fuel pas by.
So I bypassed the fuel filter and it fired right up!
But when she's idle, I hear quite a loud knock from the left hand side.

 

[tommycarl]

Well that sounds like a pretty good start. Before you go much farther though, you need to be careful about revving the engine or even running it for very long if there's really a "knock" in the engine that could be signs of low oil pressure and/or a bad bearing(s). If the noise doesn't basically go away at a fast idle, I suggest that you don't let the engine get hot just yet.

You need to be sure of course you have good oil pressure, but that's actually pretty hard to do without a gauge. A "knock" always seems bad, but may not be as bad as it sounds and might even be borderline "normal", so let's consider a couple of other things and stay optimistic. You say it does it at idle... how fast is idle? What does it sound like at 1,000 RPM? How about 1200 RPM?

What oil did you use? Type and weight?

Can you try and pinpoint the noise with a screwdriver or other solid material held to your ear and touched at various places on the engine while it's making the noise?

I'm hoping actually that you might have some cam chain slapping going on at very low RPM. I also want to get a feel for valve adjustment... although you'd probably call that a "tick", not a knock.

 

[Ricardoc4]

Well, I just tried to start it again since I haven't had any time to work on it.
It still won't work with the fuel filter.
Idle is around 1300 rpm. The knock or tick is gone at higher rpm.
To be honest I don't know where I should start..
I can't get to the motor today anymore because of my girlfriend obligations and such..

The first thing I will do tomorrow after work is to check where the knock is coming from.
I will use the screwdriver method for sure!

The oil I used is just a cheap brand 10W40.
Since I want to do another oil change once I get it running properly.

 

[tommycarl]

Well you've already started, and done a pretty good job at that. I have to tell you... BE PATIENT. Look at it this way... did you expect to do only as much as you've done, and have the bike running? I see it as pretty darn lucky to be as far as you are. I'd naturally like it more if you could just take it out and ride it now, but how far from that are you, really? We have brakes to work on, right? I'll have to read your intro again.

As for the fuel flow and filter, be sure that when you put the filter in, you have as much downward flow as possible. I honestly have trouble even figuring out problems with those sometimes, but often wonder if I get air trapped in there... doesn't make sense to me and I make up things sometimes, so let's not get hung up on that. Maybe someone else will jump in and help us out.

What I think you should check on, just so you know what you have, is whether to not there's some sort of fuel lock on you bike. I'm not saying that it would even have anything to do with the filter issue, just that you need to know what you're dealing with. Some bikes have a vacuum activated petcock... the petcock won't open unless the engine is turning over and sucking a hose to a diaphragm on the petcock. Some DOHCs have a different vacuum type shutoff that I think is mounted to the carbs, I've not seen one, but have heard that they can be problematic... I think it's referred to as the "Son of Satan" shutoff. the intent, as I understand it. is to shut of the fuel so you don't need to shutoff the petcock to prevent fuel flow. Considering that you had fuel overflowing your carb bowls, I assume that you don't have a vacuum shutoff, or that it isn't working if you do have one. You can hopefully get an idea from the manual as to what the shutoffs would look like, and if you have one.

I'm a little concerned about the knocking if it's still there at 1300 RPM. That sounds like a pretty fast idle, but maybe not... your tack could be off as well. Does it sound like a pretty high idle speed? At what RPM does the noise go away?